Jordan: When you hear of an outbreak of a virus, you think of a sudden explosion of sickness, or a cluster of people infected. Maybe it’s something like a daycare or in school. Or from one bad ingredient at a dinner party. Or from one product sold in the same place at about the same time. What we don’t imagine is an outbreak that spans nearly a year, across multiple provinces, Spread by food products from different brands only to eventually be traced back to the one thing each case has in common.
News clip: A third death has now been reported in connection to the listeria outbreak linked to great value and silk plant based milks that we’ve been reporting on.
Jordan: The listeriosis outbreak was last August. It took months for officials to even realize there was an outbreak happening. Now, if you think back for a moment to the early days of the pandemic, you might recall contact tracing, tracking the virus back through where people who are infected have been.
This investigation was like that, only over months instead of days, and including everything a person has eaten, instead of just who they saw in person. In June, though, public health finally figured out the culprit. The story of how they did it is a mark of modern sleuthing, but also includes a lucky break.
Without that work and that break, some Canadians would still be drinking their preferred brand of contaminated plant based milk without ever realizing how deadly it could be.
I’m Jordan Heath Rawlings. This is The Big Story. Hannah Alberga is a health reporter with The Canadian Press where she has been covering, um, I guess a pretty unusual outbreak. Hannah?
Hannah Aberga: Yeah, I think you can say that and thanks so much for having me.
Jordan: You’re very welcome. And before we get into exactly what’s happened here, maybe just give us a sense of the business of plant based milk these days.
Uh, how familiar are people with it? How popular is it?
Hannah Aberga: Well, in terms of popularity, when you go to a coffee shop and they offer you, you know, what kind of milk do you want? That’s what we’re talking about here. We’re, we’re talking about those non dairy milks. So that could be soy. It could be almond, whatever your preference may be.
So when we’re talking about how big it is, I mean, it’s big enough that we’re, we’re seeing coffee shops and restaurants climatized to that. They actually have to offer this like big chains as big as Tim Hortons have plant based options now. So. It’s pretty big.
Jordan: And what exactly is listeria and what are the symptoms of this virus?
Hannah Aberga: Okay. So listeria in the simplest of terms is an environmental bacteria, which just means that it’s a bacteria that can grow on food. And usually when we’re talking about this, we’re talking about. More protein based products. So deli meats, unpasteurized cheeses. For those of us who were around in 2008, we’ll think about Maple Leaf’s foods and their listeria outbreak
Jordan: in
Hannah Aberga: terms of symptoms, really similar overlap with something as simple as a stomach bug, so a fever, nausea, vomiting, muscle aches, and so that means that.
If you have a non severe case, you might think that you have a stomach bug, which is totally fine and your body can, can cope with the listeria because you’re healthy and you’re, you know, within a more generally young age bracket. And so, um, something we’ll talk about today is just about how this impacts different populations and, and how we’re seeing that play out.
Jordan: When we discuss the current outbreak that we’re seeing, and I mean, even the term current here is a little weird, and you can explain that to us, but like, what are we talking about in terms of, like, the number of cases, geographic location, et cetera, et cetera?
Hannah Aberga: So in terms of the number of cases, the latest figures show us that there’s 20, and that’s across four different provinces in Canada.
So it’s not necessarily, I mean, it is considered a national recall when we’re talking about. The fact that, uh, where this outbreak came from, uh, the products have been recalled, which, which of course we can touch on, but just going back to the outbreak itself, it’s across the country, but it hasn’t touched every single province.
It’s touched Ontario, Alberta, Quebec, and Nova Scotia. And, uh, 20 people across the country have been infected. Uh, 15 of those have been hospitalized and three people have died, um, all of them in Ontario. And so, in terms of the, the span of this, it’s, the number of infected people is relatively small. But, relative to the number of people infected, the number of people who have died is relatively high.
If you’re, if you’re looking at three out of 20, like that’s proportionately a pretty high figure. And so what that means is that the people who are getting sick are getting pretty sick. And when I’m talking about 20 infected people, that number is actually completely inaccurate because those are only the number of people who have been sick enough to actually go seek health care.
And so there might be many more people who have been sick, But they’re relatively healthy. Like I said, they, it went through them like a stomach bug. And so we don’t count them because we don’t know who they are. They’ve never necessarily even gone to the doctor. And so the figures are kind of a bit funny here and, and hard to pin down.
Jordan: Well, your story for CP focused on how epidemiologists connected the dots to even understand what was happening with this outbreak. Why was that so challenging?
Hannah Aberga: There’s really a number of reasons why it was challenging. And the first is it starts with the incubation period of listeria. So all that means is really just how long it can take when you’re infected for symptoms to start showing up.
And for listeria, that’s 70 days. So, I mean, that’s a two month period of time. Right. Like, when you compare that to, like, food poisoning, like, that shows up relatively soon. Like, you’re gonna know if you’re sick. But the problem is, if you don’t know if you’re sick for a couple months, you don’t necessarily remember what you ate a couple months ago, right?
Like, if I were to say, okay, Jordan, you were infected on August 26. Can you tell me what you ate, uh, on this exact date two months ago?
Jordan: Yeah. I
Hannah Aberga: have no idea.
Jordan: Right.
Hannah Aberga: How I would possibly answer that question. And so all that’s to say, uh, that’s one of the reasons that this has been a challenge to track.
Another reason is that the first case came up in August 2023. The next case came up in September and the following in December, and that was, uh, not in one province but in two. And so, it’s really challenging to pin together three cases in separate provinces that were across a months long period of time.
So really, up until there was a cluster of cases in June. It was almost impossible to actually track this outbreak.
Jordan: So tell me then, yeah, what happened in June and it led to a recall? And I guess, um, that’s when, uh, we were able to determine where exactly, uh, the virus was coming from?
Hannah Aberga: Exactly. So, in June of this year, there was an outbreak of nine cases in Ontario.
And that outbreak allowed health investigators to actually start to, A, do whole genome sequencing, which is essentially just taking a look at the bacteria in your system and looking at what the genetic code of it is. And so if you can see that these nine patients have that same whole genome sequencing, that’s sort of clue number one of, Okay, this is clearly linked cases.
Clue number two is talking to them about what they’re eating and finding a common source. And because this was a cluster that took place within, you know, a matter of days or weeks, they could more adequately recall what the, overlapping products might be. One of the things that, uh, you know, the director of the Public Health Agency of Canada’s, um, outbreak management has said to me was that they got lucky in this case because the product is one that you eat every single day, generally, or I should say drink.
because, you know, you have this plant based milk in your coffee or in your cereal or what have you. And so she said that she’s, she’s been on cases where, you know, you have like a profiterole or something that you’re really not eating on an everyday basis. I mean, maybe you are, but not everyone in that population might be.
And so that also kind of gave investigators a sort of solid head start in terms of putting together these pieces.
Jordan: And what did they eventually determine was the cause behind the outbreak in terms of like specificity? Is it just one type of milk? Are we talking about a whole bunch? Like where did they pin it down?
Hannah Aberga: So they actually were able to pin it down to a specific third party facility that produced two brands of plant based milk, silk and great value.
But because they pinned it down to a production line, That actually meant that there was a whole bunch of different kinds of products under those two brands that were affected or potentially affected. So that, like I said earlier, that could be almond milk, it could be soy milk, there’s kind of a, a list that I won’t bore you with now, but, uh, it is available on, uh, on Health Canada’s website.
And one of the ways in which they were able to trace this back to the facility was that when investigators were speaking to infected people in Ontario, they asked them if they still had this plant based milk in their fridge. Thank you very much. And some of them said, Yes, I do. And so they checked the plant based milk.
And the product code was on that, that carton. And they had several people with the same product code, which traced back to the facility. And so this was another case where there, there was luck in that this was a product that people hadn’t thrown out yet. Given that plant based milk has a long duration of time before it expires.
And so, again, this was, this was how they, they tied it all back.
Jordan: And so they figured it out in June. As you just mentioned, um, plant based milk has a long expiry date. And as you also mentioned, you know, it can take 70 days for illness to show up. So have we continued, uh, to see cases since then and will we continue to see them?
Hannah Aberga: So when I spoke to the outbreak director, she said on Friday that cases appear to be slowing. However, given that there’s that 70 day incubation period, they won’t declare this outbreak over until early October if this continues. And that’s because of, as I said, the incubation period and then the delay in reporting as a result of that incubation period.
So they really want to some extra sort of support. Time to really verify that this is done, we’re in the clear. And the expiry date of the plant based products that contained listeria was in October. And so that could mean Regardless of the fact that the Canadian Food Inspection Agency has, you know, issued warnings to say, please throw out this product that has this code, that all corporations have been told to throw out this product if it has this code again.
You know, it’s, it’s hard to say if, if let’s say I had, I got a case at Costco and I kept it in my my closet and, and, and I remembered that the one I opened back, back at the time I had thrown out, but maybe I forgot that the ones in my, in my cupboard are still there. And so they just really want to make sure that they’re checking off all the boxes here to make sure that this is over.
Jordan: What should people know now going forward? I guess, A, you know, if, if they’ve had symptoms, but, you know, they obviously didn’t put it together, as you mentioned, you know, if it’s, if it’s just a bad stomach bug, you get over it, you don’t think about it, um, should those people do anything? And, uh, what should people know going forward about plant based milk?
Hannah Aberga: No, it’s, it’s, this has gone through your system. You don’t have to worry about alerting a hospital or getting tested or anything like that. It’s okay. It’s, it’s, I don’t want to say it’s not a big deal because it is a big deal for some people, but if you’re a healthy individual and this has already run its course, there’s no reason to panic.
The only people that are hospitalized are those who, who have really been severely impacted. And so that’s generally people who are over the age of 50, people who might be pregnant or younger children. These are populations that are more vulnerable and therefore would perhaps have more severe case of this.
So that’s really, uh, what the focus is here.
Jordan: And just in terms of, uh, the products in general, you know, like you said, I had thought that, uh, listeria concerns came, uh, with, yeah, stuff like raw cheese or, or deli meats. Is there anything to be concerned about plant based milk going forward? Um, what should people know?
Hannah Aberga: Well, the thing to keep in mind here is that this outbreak was tied to a specific production line at the facility where this plant based milk was made. It’s not because plant based milk is suddenly seeing some sort of listeria spread and that you should get off of this product. It’s that this was a very specific case and until we see more there’s no reason to believe that this is something that should be of a wider concern in terms of this product type.
I mean like think about with the maple leaf food listeria outbreak does that mean that you have stopped eating deli meat altogether?
Jordan: Nope, I probably won’t. I probably, I mean, I don’t drink plant based milk. That probably wouldn’t put me off of it. I just find this whole, I mean, it’s just way more interesting than your normal, um, sort of recall outbreak story just because of the timelines involved and how difficult it must have been to crack.
Hannah Aberga: 100 percent and It’s really interesting because when you speak to health experts, they’re saying that this is the first case of plant based beverage listeria outbreak that they’ve seen. And of course, it’s completely possible that there was some outbreak in some region that it’s just not recorded on a public accessible journal or database.
But from what is accessible, this is really the first and it’s caught experts by surprise in addition to Me, you and everyone else.
Jordan: Hannah, thank you so much for this. It’s really interesting.
Hannah Aberga: No, my absolute pleasure.
Jordan: Hannah Alberta is a health reporter for the Canadian Press. That was the big story. For more, you can head to the big story podcast.ca.
You can also shoot us an email if you’ve got any feedback or episode suggestions. The address to do that is hello at the big story podcast.ca. Or if you’re. Still a phone person. You can give us a call and leave us a voicemail. 416 935 5935. For those of you who love leaving feedback for us, I’ll let you know.
It’s a long weekend coming up, so Joe and I will be reading some of it on the holiday Monday. The Big Story is available in all your podcast players and if it’s on your smart speakers, just ask them to play the Big Story podcast. Thanks for listening. I’m Jordan Heath Rawlings. We’ll talk tomorrow.
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